Last modified: 2013-10-30 09:27:06 UTC
Can you please offer a way to turn off that god-awful following stuff that gets sent to one's browser on every edit? Also don't make the solution dependent on javascript or stylesheets. Check a prefernce cookie or whatever if you must, and then don't send it down the phone lines in the first place -- and over again fresh for every edit too... yuck. Offer users who wish not these acres of stuff, instead a link to a cheatsheet, that they can click if they feel the need. Urg... how unprofessional -- its like your driving school instructor must sit next to you for the rest of your life... and he's heavy and weighting down his side of the car too... Insert: – — … ° ≈ ≠ ≤ ≥ ± − × ÷ ← → · § Sign your username: ~~~~ Wiki markup: {{}} | [] [[]] [[Category:]] #REDIRECT [[]] <s></s> <sup></sup> <sub></sub> <code></code> <blockquote></blockquote> <ref></ref> {{Reflist}} <references/> <includeonly></includeonly> <noinclude></noinclude> {{DEFAULTSORT:}} <nowiki></nowiki> <!-- --> <span class="plainlinks"></span> • (templates) Symbols: ~ | ¡ ¿ † ‡ ↔ ↑ ↓ • ¶ # ¹ ² ³ ½ ⅓ ⅔ ¼ ¾ ⅛ ⅜ ⅝ ⅞ ∞ ‘ “ ’ ” ¤ ₳ ฿ ₵ ¢ ₡ ₢ $ ₫ ₯ € ₠ ₣ ƒ ₴ ₭ ₤ ℳ ₥ ₦ ₧ ₰ £ ៛ ₨ ₪ ৳ ₮ ₩ ¥ ♠ ♣ ♥ ♦ Characters: Á á Ć ć É é Í í Ĺ ĺ Ń ń Ó ó Ŕ ŕ Ś ś Ú ú Ý ý Ź ź À à È è Ì ì Ò ò Ù ù  â Ĉ ĉ Ê ê Ĝ ĝ Ĥ ĥ Î î Ĵ ĵ Ô ô Ŝ ŝ Û û Ŵ ŵ Ŷ ŷ Ä ä Ë ë Ï ï Ö ö Ü ü Ÿ ÿ ß Ã ã Ẽ ẽ Ĩ ĩ Ñ ñ Õ õ Ũ ũ Ỹ ỹ Ç ç Ģ ģ Ķ ķ Ļ ļ Ņ ņ Ŗ ŗ Ş ş Ţ ţ Đ đ Ů ů Ǎ ǎ Č č Ď ď Ě ě Ǐ ǐ Ľ ľ Ň ň Ǒ ǒ Ř ř Š š Ť ť Ǔ ǔ Ž ž Ā ā Ē ē Ī ī Ō ō Ū ū Ȳ ȳ Ǣ ǣ ǖ ǘ ǚ ǜ Ă ă Ĕ ĕ Ğ ğ Ĭ ĭ Ŏ ŏ Ŭ ŭ Ċ ċ Ė ė Ġ ġ İ ı Ż ż Ą ą Ę ę Į į Ǫ ǫ Ų ų Ḍ ḍ Ḥ ḥ Ḷ ḷ Ḹ ḹ Ṃ ṃ Ṇ ṇ Ṛ ṛ Ṝ ṝ Ṣ ṣ Ṭ ṭ Ł ł Ő ő Ű ű Ŀ ŀ Ħ ħ Ð ð Þ þ Œ œ Æ æ Ø ø Å å Ə ə • {{Unicode|}} Greek: Ά ά Έ έ Ή ή Ί ί Ό ό Ύ ύ Ώ ώ Α α Β β Γ γ Δ δ Ε ε Ζ ζ Η η Θ θ Ι ι Κ κ Λ λ Μ μ Ν ν Ξ ξ Ο ο Π π Ρ ρ Σ σ ς Τ τ Υ υ Φ φ Χ χ Ψ ψ Ω ω • {{Polytonic|}} • (polytonic list) Cyrillic: А а Б б В в Г г Ґ ґ Ѓ ѓ Д д Ђ ђ Е е Ё ё Є є Ж ж З з Ѕ ѕ И и І і Ї ї Й й Ј ј К к Ќ ќ Л л Љ љ М м Н н Њ њ О о П п Р р С с Т т Ћ ћ У у Ў ў Ф ф Х х Ц ц Ч ч Џ џ Ш ш Щ щ Ъ ъ Ы ы Ь ь Э э Ю ю Я я IPA: t̪ d̪ ʈ ɖ ɟ ɡ ɢ ʡ ʔ ɸ ʃ ʒ ɕ ʑ ʂ ʐ ʝ ɣ ʁ ʕ ʜ ʢ ɦ ɱ ɳ ɲ ŋ ɴ ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ ʙ ʀ ɾ ɽ ɫ ɬ ɮ ɺ ɭ ʎ ʟ ɥ ʍ ɧ ɓ ɗ ʄ ɠ ʛ ʘ ǀ ǃ ǂ ǁ ɨ ʉ ɯ ɪ ʏ ʊ ɘ ɵ ɤ ə ɚ ɛ ɜ ɝ ɞ ʌ ɔ ɐ ɶ ɑ ɒ ʰ ʷ ʲ ˠ ˤ ⁿ ˡ ˈ ˌ ː ˑ ̪ • {{IPA|}}
This is a problem with [[MediaWiki:Edittools]] on the English Wikipedia (or other Wikipedias), not a problem with MediaWiki or site configuration. Ask the sysops on the appropriate wiki to change that message.
Indeed, have those symbols available instead in the already present "Editing help (opens in new window)" link. Anyway, many programs have "experienced user" or "advanced" settings to cut off the training wheel baggage, please. > This is a problem with [[MediaWiki:Edittools]] on the English Wikipedia OK, I'll take it there. Thanks.
I think the request is to create a preference to disable edittools completely
Yes, sounds like what I wrote in [[MediaWiki_talk:Edittools#Allow_users_to_not_swollow_it_down_the_phone_lines_in_the_first_place]]. How you do it I leave up to the pros.
Edittools currently contains things other than tools, on enwiki at least, but it might be a good idea to allow turning it off anyway. Normally we don't like having too many user preferences, however, and it *is* gzipped in transit if your browser supports that. Not sure if we want preference clutter for this.
Indeed, as it is "edittools" and not "obligatory legal notice that needs to be sent fail safe on each request", there should be a way to stop having it sent. And that some sites (wikipedia) have stuck some seeming legal jazz on the end of it is thier own fault, as it is clearly named "edittools". But then they will figure out a way of bloating some other thing that people can't turn off from wastefully coming down the wires. If it were in a separate file one could stop from being requested with proxy tools like wwwoffle. But then again, using that when editing is no fun. > Not sure if we want preference clutter for this. A one time pain will save a year of bytes down the drain. Plus often there is so much crud accumulated, one can hardly find where one was editing. Anyways also a through review is due of the bloat coming down the lines in terms of what can be moved into helper .js and .css pages, so people who don't use js or css won't be burdened byte wise. Or maybe the static stuff has been already moved there.
A different approach would be that you could deside yourself (in your preferences) what exactly is displayed in the edittools. For example, I never use <blockquote>, but I use {{}}, and I would like to have {{{}}} and {}. This can be done with js, but it would be nice if people that can't write js can do this stuff without any help.
The problem is, the format is different on all wikis, so you couldnt selectively hide. Maybe turn off edittools and jave a second edittools available per-user?
(In reply to comment #8) > The problem is, the format is different on all wikis, so you couldnt > selectively hide. Maybe turn off edittools and jave a second edittools > available per-user? > Something like the user javascript
I had a plan to implement this using Ajax since one or two years ago. But an Ajax-only solution wouldn't be good for people without JavaScript who do want these special symbols and tools. Rather than a preferences page I had thought about something like MediaWiki:Sidebar but in a user subpage that each user could edit. Of course this would only appeal to technical type users.
The ability to disable Edittools it may be necessary in any project - see e.g. diff on MediaWiki.org: http://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?diff=154319&oldid=154116
(In reply to comment #10) > I had a plan to implement this using Ajax since one or two years ago. > > But an Ajax-only solution wouldn't be good for people without JavaScript who do > want these special symbols and tools. They depend on JavaScript to begin with...
> They depend on JavaScript to begin with... Therefore they [all that gunk] has no business coming down the phone line for users who have turned javascript off. Its natural place is in an additional .js file, and not the page itself.
The English Wiktionary has an Ajax implementation of Edit Tools for the search box. It's a hack but proof it's not so hard to pull off. To see it in action go to http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/User:Connel%20MacKenzie/Preferences The source code is at: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/User:Connel_MacKenzie/keypad.js Ajax is definitely the way to go for this already JavaScript-only feature. See also the older Bug 9754, "Customisable per-user edit tools"
Or maybe dump all those wacky characters into a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Toolbar or something. Anyway, all those characters are also Euro-centric.
Or if you insist on having all those never-used-in-a-lifetime characters hauled around wherever you go like some kind of alphabet set for children, you might as well make them into plain strips for copy-and-paste: ÁáĆćÉéÍíĹĺŃńÓóŔশÚúÝýŹź, with no links involved. (Are you guys trying to make a world record, the most links for the least link text? Yes, you sure figured out the right way, march through lots of UTF-8 single characters.) This would cut down some on the giant bulk, and those links won't work anyway if one has javascript turned off. Anyway, all this is best gotten by the user clicking "Editing help (opens in new window)".
(In reply to comment #5) > Normally we don't like having too many user preferences, however, and it *is* > gzipped in transit if your browser supports that. I don't care if it is printed on microfilm, it still takes too fucking long to load. > Not sure if we want preference clutter for this. I realize that the bloatware problem is probably unique to enwiki, but if we can't allow users to selectively disable problematically huge system messages, and if certain communities habitually reject requests that involve reducing interface clutter, could you at least create a "monobook-light" skin which uses the MediaWiki default for every system message. Note edittool crapflooding was part of the problem observed in [[bugzilla:13130]] (ironically similar tracking number, hmm...) Charlotte J. Webb
Help, now commons has all the babyfood characters spewing forth too. There should be a preference, so all wikis can *inject a file full of beginner help (as seen on en, commons). and all (power) users (with less than extra wideband connections) can *turn off that silliness.
Bug 17647 related.
On English Wiktionary this bloats a 24 kB edit page to 245 kB. Even zipped, this more than doubles the size of transmitted HTML from about 8 kB to 20 kB. It's pointless to send this to every editor including those who can't use it without javascript. This is a content management system after all, so can we manage the non-content just a bit?
(In reply to comment #15) > Or maybe dump all those wacky characters into a > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Toolbar > or something. Anyway, all those characters are also Euro-centric. Could anyone do this with the enhanced toolbar from usability initiative, as pointed by Naoko in August 6th, 2009? http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/08/try-the-usability-beta See also: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki_talk:Edittools#Duplication_of_special_characters http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki_talk:Edittools#Duplication_of_special_characters
See also this: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17647#c5
Any updates on this?
Editing tools are browser and OS features. If a website wants to provide an alternative, that's fine, as long as it is optional. Please. Let's just add a toggle switch to eliminate this stuff. Not only is it clutter and bloat, but it's far inferior to my OS tools.
As of 1.17 and the WikiEditor extension, Edittools can, should or is in the toolbar of the editor (rather than taking up space below the editor). You can hide it by collapsing (if not already) that part of the editor.
Bug 37657 related.
See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:Gadget/proposals?oldid=512829808#Edit_tools https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VPT?oldid=512832372#Edit_tools
