Last modified: 2011-07-13 17:24:39 UTC

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Bug 7446 - Grammaticalisation of esperanto talk page don't work everywhere
Grammaticalisation of esperanto talk page don't work everywhere
Product: MediaWiki
Classification: Unclassified
Interface (Other open bugs)
PC Windows 2000
: Low normal (vote)
: ---
Assigned To: Nobody - You can work on this!
Depends on:
  Show dependency treegraph
Reported: 2006-09-29 22:10 UTC by Arno Lagrange
Modified: 2011-07-13 17:24 UTC (History)
2 users (show)

See Also:
Web browser: ---
Mobile Platform: ---
Assignee Huggle Beta Tester: ---


Description Arno Lagrange 2006-09-29 22:10:14 UTC
In eo Wp the wrong "vikipediisto diskuto" has changed to "vikipediista diskuto"
by a grammatical addition in the software. But it results that in other
projects, when choosing esperanto as interface language one get : 

"* **** root ns:usera " instead of "vikipediista" ("root ns:usera" = "root
ns:user" + "a" )
Comment 1 Niklas Laxström 2007-12-15 22:22:22 UTC
Can you be more specific? It is impossible to know what is wrong and where from that description.
Comment 2 Arno Lagrange 2007-12-16 12:06:04 UTC
'User' of a mediawiki powered project could be ccalled "vikipediisto" in Wikipedia but "Uzulo" in an other project. User talk page then should be called "Vikipediista diskuto" or "uzula diskuto"
The parameter ns:user when grammaticalised should be the root without final o ('uzul') and root + 'a diskuto' for talk page. 
ns:user = vikipediist +o or uzul+ o
ns:user talk page = vikipediist+ a diskuto or uzul+a diskuto
Comment 3 Niklas Laxström 2008-10-06 08:37:44 UTC
Do you mean that the namespace name of User and User talk are wrong in Esperanto projects other than Wikipedia?
Comment 4 Arno Lagrange 2008-10-06 09:51:09 UTC
I just checked differents mediawiki based wikis. Now they all have only "diskuto" or "discussion" (default english) and I didn't have seen root ns:usera anywhere. "User" became "Paĝo de uzanto". It's not bad. It would be more smart to have  
ns:user (page)= (paĝo de) uzanto
ns:user talk page = uzanta diskuto
Comment 5 Niklas Laxström 2009-01-31 22:11:27 UTC
I still don't know what should be fixed, except that the esperanto user namespaces are wikipedia specific:
        NS_USER           => 'Vikipediisto', # FIXME: Generalize v-isto kaj v-io
        NS_USER_TALK      => 'Vikipediista_diskuto',
Comment 6 Arno Lagrange 2009-02-01 10:04:23 UTC
As said in the 1st post more than two years ago : NEVER NOWHERE DISPLAY "**** root ns:usera "
I just checked different wikis runned by MediaWiki. We now have Uzulpaĝo / Diskuto (User page / Talk). So it is half fixed. It would be better to have Uzulpaĝo / Uzula diskuto but it is not so bad as  "**** root ns:usera "
That perhaps will be fixed after two more years ;-)
Comment 7 Niklas Laxström 2009-02-01 10:11:47 UTC
Sorry but I have no idea what your markup means. What is "****", what is "root", what is "ns:usera"?

Are you talking about what reads in the tab above the page in monobook skin? If that is the case, it it not possible to fix, because the same text "talk" is there for every namespace.

FYI: only intance of **** I could find:
languages/messages/MessagesEo.php:'defemailsubject'  => '{{SITENAME}} ****-retmesaĝo',
Comment 8 Dan Collins 2011-07-12 04:02:29 UTC
I don't think anyone really knows what this bug is even about. It might have something to do with localization, but isn't really specific enough, and is now over four years out of date. Closing invalid unless someone can provide some clear information on what they see, where, and what they think it should say.
Comment 9 Arno Lagrange 2011-07-13 14:47:35 UTC
Yes it looks like partly fixed in some contexts. For example in epo.anarchopedia 
the tabs now are 'uzulpaĝo' and 'diskuto'. It could be better, but it is not bad. 
There is also {{ns:5}} = 'Anarĥopedio diskuto' that should be  'Anarĥopedia diskuto' but it perhaps is specific problem of this project and not really a MediaWiki bug unless if ns:5 would be difined as 'Project' 'talk' as it seems, and cannot be grammatically correct: compounded words are not constructed in Esperanto as in English:  
en Project (Wikipedia Anarchopedia ...)
eo Projekto (Vikipedio Anarĥopedio ...)
en Project talk  (Wikipedia talk Anarchopedia talk ...)
eo Projekta diskuto (Vikipedia diskuto Anarĥopedia diskuto ...)

In few words ns:x+1 in Esperanto should not be defined as 'ns:x'+'talk' but must be apartly defined to match Esperanto grammar.
Comment 10 Niklas Laxström 2011-07-13 17:09:48 UTC
I thought this was about Wikipedia or some other Wikimedia project. I still have no idea what needs to be changed and where.
Comment 11 Brion Vibber 2011-07-13 17:24:39 UTC
No longer an issue -- default talkspaces for eo have changed, you now get:

  NS_USER      - Uzanto
  NS_USER_TALK - Uzanto-Diskuto

To summarize the base issue -- long ago (don't know if the system's even still there), the user or meta namespaces could be individually overridden, and the associated talk page namespace would be named in a way that for some languages attempted to fit the appropriate grammar.

The old Esperanto namespaces were done in a nasty way, using Noun for subject ('Uzulo', 'Projekto') and Adjective-Noun for object ('Uzula diskuto', 'Projekta diskuto').

They have been since changed to form the talk namespaces as compounds of two nouns -- so 'Uzulo-Diskuto', 'Projekto-Diskuto' etc.

It looks like some of the manually-specified namespaces on still use the old style ('Vikipedio', 'Vikipedia diskuto') while the default ones including the user name space are on the new style, so there's no grammar conflict issue remaining.

It wouldn't hurt to modernize the manually-set namespace names, but that should be a separate shell bug.

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